In a thinly-veiled critique of conditions under which members of the Guyana Police Force serve and those in which detainees are held, Caricom’s Assistant Secretary-General Dr Edward Greene yesterday called for security to move away from brute force tactics, while President Bharrat Jagdeo insisted that such methods were sometimes justified in the fight against violent crime.
The 18 commissioners of police attending the 24th conference of the Association of Caribbean Commissions of Police stand in front of the Pegasus Hotel where the conference is being held. (Photo by Jules Gibson)
Addressing the opening of the annual conference of the Association of Caribbean Commissioners of Police (ACCP) at the Pegasus Hotel, Greene said that while many regional governments have made investments in upgrading the infrastructure to facilitate the work of the police services, much more need to be done to improve the enabling environment in which officers function.
He used the situation in Guyana to make his case, saying a visit to several police stations in Georgetown and its environs would illustrate the “substandard facilities” in which police officers are expected to work and be effective as well as “dehumanising conditions” under which persons are detained. These conditions, he said, “epitomise the abuse of their human rights. This, in turn, has serious implications for the image of the police and the legitimacy of their role as one of the agencies of human and social development. Hopefully, these conditions in our detention centres and prisons are not widespread throughout Guyana and the region. If so, there is a crisis that must be urgently addressed.”
Greene’s description of the conditions under which detainees are held echoed a host of complaints about the less than humane conditions under which persons are held at some holding facilities, and in particular the Brickdam lock-ups.
In what appeared to be a clear response to Greene, President Jagdeo admitted that the working conditions for police officers are not ideal, but he said the country is still recovering from a period where a large portion of its resources went to servicing debt. He also insisted that the escalation of violent crime, in which AK-47s are being used, justifies the use of brute force.
According to Greene, who is Ambassador of the Directorate of Human and Social Development at Caricom, any strategy of police reform needs to incorporate the improvement of the conditions of service for police officers as well as the environment in which citizens are detained or incarcerated. He told the commissioners that the ACCP can greatly contribute by establishing protocols and standards for implementing requirements in the areas that form part of the “structure of police reform, intended to combine appropriate punishment with a formula for rehabilitation of those who commit crimes and reintegrating them into society, as worthwhile citizens.”
In his feature address, President Jagdeo said the government is constantly working towards improving the conditions for police officers. However, he said that while the conditions are not ideal, he has seen what commitment and leadership can do, citing results in crime fighting because of the commitment of Police Commissioner Henry Greene and Army Chief-of-Staff Gary Best. “We are coming out of a tough situation, we don’t have the best conditions in the world but I am proud of them because they have performed well… comparable with many countries who have better pay,” he said.
Distinctly disturbing
According to Greene, the challenges faced by the region in dealing with crime and violence are well known, given the distinctly disturbing crime statistics for many countries. He said the strategy enunciated by Caricom’s Council for National Security and Law Enforcement (CONSLE) places emphasis on collaboration in border security, information and surveillance, witness protection, control of drugs and arms, training and capacity building of the law enforcement and protective services.
Although there has been some progress, he said, it is increasingly being recognised that “the key to sustainable programme rests with the construction and implementation of crime prevention strategies.” This, Greene added, requires a new approach to partnership between the police and other stakeholders in the government service, private sector, civil society, the schools and youth movements and faith-based organisations. “There ought also to be an alliance between the police and our research centres that provides analysis of trends and guidelines for behaviour change,” he said.
He urged that the ACCP follow up with and support the call of the Vice-Chancellor of the University of the West Indies for the establishment of a Centre of Excellence for Crime and Violence to be involved in research and training. Greene said it could be a useful focal point to provide the empirical information to guide, monitor and evaluate the impact of police reform programmes.
According to Green, the underlying factors of police reform rest with the creation of viable networks around common goals and practices and he quoted part of a Stabroek News editorial, which he said aptly articulated what needs to be done in police reform: “The events of the past decade have made it clear that the brute-force tactic of sending out hunting parties to shoot bandits has not eradicated those transnational crimes which keep pumping guns, drugs, dirty money and criminal violence into the country. Systematic police reform − that emphasises crime intelligence and human security − is necessary if the country is to enjoy a sustained era of public safety and economic stability. Only a transformed security environment will attract foreign investment and persuade local talent to remain in the country.”
However, President Jagdeo told Greene that there are times when brute force needed to be used by police officers. “Yes Eddie [Greene], we need brute force because when you have people shooting at you with AK-47s you need to send out brute force with AK 47s to get back at them. You can’t go out there and smile and shake their hands and negotiate.”
The president also stressed that policy makers need to be unambiguous in their support of the security forces, adding that there should be care with regard to human rights. He explained that it sometimes appears that the scale is tilted more in favour of the perpetrators than the victims “and that can’t be right.” He said the organisations that tout human rights need to take in consideration that there are sometimes psychopaths with AK-47 rifles slaughtering people.
When addressing the issue of the root cause of crime, President Jagdeo said there is need for analysis, because while bad economic times may cause more persons to be involved in crime, in the case of drug dealers the motivation is greed and not poverty.
Transnational
Meanwhile, President Jagdeo said that to address the crime situation in the region domestic actions alone would not be sufficient. He explained that crimes being committed now are not the same as in years gone by because crime has now become transnational, based on the flow of drugs and guns into the region.
As he has done in the past, the president called for a partnership between the developed and developing nations, saying they should be multilateral with all countries operating as equals. He called on the commissioners to analyse how the developed countries act when they are faced with security challenges to their societies. He pointed out that after the 9/11 terrorist attack in the US, the Republicans and Democrats came together and passed the Patriot Act, which reversed many of the gains that the civil rights movement fought for over many years.
“Sometimes I think we feel ashamed when we have to act to protect our societies, we are ashamed because we think we are reversing civil gains and that may be a cause for concern…. But we are not on the same level, society does not act together, opposition and governments don’t get together; often they play politics with crime in our societies,” Jagdeo said.
He said smaller countries are often lectured to by the developed countries and are placed in international reports as eroding civil rights when they are doing the opposite. “And we feel ashamed because we feel we have to comply with this international notion of civil rights behaviour while our people are suffering and while they are crying out for tough actions,” he noted.
He said the region’s countries have to do the things that are practical to give their security forces the same tools that the security forces have in the developed world. The president added that it does not have to do with money but also the legislation which could better enable them to fight crime. According to Jagdeo, the fixation with strategies often overshadows the tools which should be given by the policy-makers.
President Jagdeo also spoke about the challenge posed by the reorientation of the economies in the region. He said many countries have fiscal deficits and as result the calls for them to spend more money on security would fall on deaf ears or exacerbate the situation. The president also touched on food security and the issue of climate change, saying both are challenges that pose a catastrophic risk to the territories. As an illustration of the risk the region faces from climate change, he noted that the flood experienced by Guyana a few years ago wiped out the equivalent of 60% of the country’s Gross Domestic Product (GDP).
are they physical training days of a police officer finished when he becomes a chief-of-staff??
WHAT EVER HAPPENED TO DEMOLISHING THE BRICKDAM LOCK-UPS??
what nonsense i wrote?? it should be “Are the physical training days of a police officer finished when he becomes a senior police officer or the commissioner of police??”
My bad.
How many days to go? The question should be: who in the pic looks like the most out of shape Commish? ISNM
SFH – The group in front looks like they are protecting their private assets from a penalty kick.
Go PPP go. First it was Customs the same thing happend next it was GAC 1999, 400 went home the corporation was then sold to PPP friends with a full staff of PPP supporters…..boom the New Guyana flag carrier didn’t last two years. The rest is now history.
Around the same time attempts was made on the Arm Services – no success there. 17 years of targeting the Public sector but they came up with little results so they inturn created another public service within the old public service and this new one is comprised of highly paid PPP supporters. They also went after the schools no more common entrance, no more Mulitilaterals, all schools in south georgetown faded, President College…lets not talk about that; all in all they approach towards public schools had a negative impact due to bad policies. Whether this was systematic or not it lead to an exponential rise in Private schools to likes we have never seen in this country. As a result the poor man suffers because not only does he not have an equal opportunity of providing a quality education for his child but he can’t afford it.
Now its ATC time….lowering the requirements gosh what more will this goverment do. It is simple if you want to attract competent and qualified persons just pay more lets say starting salary is at $150,000 and a Diplima/Degree in any Science field and i can assure you tomorrow you will get a 150 applications. They are hundreds of UG graduates every year and these people lowering the Requirements. NO SHAME.
Sandhurts bai i think ya really on to something.
Reddy…Barbados here they come.
What to give out you get in return brute forces do not always work.
Trivia here Shelly….which commissioner in this pic does not have a US Visa???
Holding a US visa is not any criteria to good policing SHF and what is your point???? You asked yourself a question in your second comment ” What nonsense I wrote” and then you did the same in the third comment…
I think Sandhurst had a few this morning or maybe too much last night. This randomness is actually quite funny.
Jagdeo must be the last of the barbarians. Brute force policing was tried in the earlier days and found not to work for it alienates a people. Every civilized nation has moved away from that kind of policing and I can’t understand why the Guyanese president would attempt to justify such methods. He is even arguing against the preferred methods of his own police commissioner who, we assume, should know what works. The more Jagdeo opens his mouth the more he reveals his intelligence.
Brute Force Policing,and “Roughing Up”,should be properly discussed by these Commissioners.They should respect the citizen’s Human Rights.They should not forget,that they are the servants of the Public.Using extreme,and un-necessary Force should be discontinued.I do hope that something meaningful comes out of this Summit.
Greene is naive and, if that is reported is true, he is out of place, protocol-wise.
This type of sissy talk is exactly what criminals want to hear.The President is quie right: BRUTE FORCE IS NECESSARY TO DEAL WITH BRUTE FORCE.How do you think we got rid of the common criminals in the past few years ? By sweet talk ? Greene, get real.
And why did he single out Guyana, or “use ” the counry as an example as reported ? He represents a regional body, with headquarters in Guyana. Doesn’t he know anything about protocol and sensitivity ?
He should have said something about the Barbados police. Recent statistics (not revealed of course by the police) show hat only 15 per cent of those who committ robberies are caught.
And has he ever been around when the Barbados police and Defence Force regularly shoot it out with drug shippers landing drugs from boats ? The officers corectly use the latest high powered weapons, not water pistols…
Jagdeo is just shamed that’s why he react, to what green said.
I don’t know what world Reddy lives in but he sure sounds outdated.
Reddy.
I agree.
Fire has to be fought with fire. You can’t fight terrorism with just diplomacy; thats why uncle sam is fighting 2 wars…
When the Free dum fighters were appointed by you know who to set fire to the land, the other side called in another to set them on fire. To this day, the One’s who started it and their supporters remain bitter that dem got burned by their own means.
Amen-ra
Shame is a sign of having good conscience; Your heroes, the PNC have NO SHAME or NO CONSCIENCE on how they’ve raped the mother land for decades.
Rodrick Jag was ashamed of the way mr. edward greene adomonished the gpf and how the police facilities are kept in the country, so in order to save face he lashed out in a way shows that he’s ill tempered and cant take criticism, and what your ppp govt is doing to guyana now, they mucking up the country more than it was, and Rodrick if i was living in guyana i wouldn’t have voted for any of the parties in guyana, they all are corrupted,and the ppp take the largest slice of the pie.
reddy and jagdeo should live in a country all by themselves. they appear to have been cut from the same cloth. old people say God don’t make mistake but in this case he did.
This is for RodRick. You obviously did not vote for the current US President. Ask Bush, rather the Republican party why they won’t smell the WHITE HOUSE in a looooooong time!!!!!!!!!
Fight fire with fire? Why don’t you go live in Afghanistan or Iraq. Why are you enjoying all the liberties you now do living in the US??
Here is what the man FK had to say about good ole roving reddy
Ignore the mediocre ramblings of the Honorary Consul of Guyana in Barbados, Norman Faria. No one should pay attention to his foolish propaganda. Propaganda can be astute and interesting but in Faria’s case, it is extremely childish. Trust the PPP Government to employ incompetent people.
Faria’s latest outpouring against me relates to my criticism of Cuba. There is no need to mention his glowing tribute about democracy in Cuba. Faria can eulogize imaginary freedoms and fictional democracy in Cuba because he lives in one of Planet Earth’s enduring democracies – Barbados. Faria isn’t going anywhere, not even in Guyana, a country that is 83, 000 square miles, that has vastly wealthier people than Barbados yet thousands of Guyanese are flocking that island of 166 square miles in search of a better life.
Faria’s friends have been in power in Guyana for over sixteen years yet Faria isn’t interested in living in Guyana
hahahhahahhahahahha I love it.
malaika06
I think you had your crystal ball upside down when you predicted who I voted for in 08.
Since September 11th 2001, did the US suffer another terrorist attack? NO!!! why do you think??? Its because the US Government took the fire fight to the terrorist’s home land and “fought fire with fire.” Bush and the present Obama Administration both said that “Freedoms aren’t free.” So what the hell you’re talking about…
I will go to Afghanistan/IraQ when you go to the land of genocide, Somalia.
This is for RodRick….your last post about the land of genocide was racist because the blogger you are rebutting did not make any statements along the line of ethnicity but rather the subject of hand in the context of fightin fir with fire, which you partly addressed. I dont have to guess, you are of Indian/Asian decent. Please note, and as a West Indian you should know this, the people of the caribbean are not from east Africa. We are decents of West and Central African. So how does your somalia comment impact this discussion? East and North Africans are more aligned with Middle Easter and Asian culture and and thought process. If you dont believe me ask the Sundanese President and he will tell you he is not Black.
Reddy could be really Faria himself….
I concur with what Dr. Edward Greene in his critique of guyana’s police force and the wider carribean how they fight crime, and president jagdeo don’t make any sense in his comments, he’s just shame that’s why he lashes out the way he did, he’s been given so much help but yet refused to implement the strategy need for good policing, what about all the help guyana get from canada and the u.k and yet guyana failed to implement them, and then jagdeo get the nerves to compare guyand to the u.s after 911.
Brute force breeds brute force and more brute force where will it end.
IT WILL COME TO AN END WHEN ALL THE INNOCENT BYSTANDERS ARE KILLED BY THE POLICE. BRUTE FORCE WITHOUT PROPER TRAINING WILL ACHIEVE NOTHING.
brute force is good.the only thing it is going to be enforced on domestic voilent offenders and petty crime and not the hard core criminals.some the things that was expected to come out of the summit is how to better the police forces due to their inability to solve major crimes,better intelligence,better commissioner of police/not years of service but competence and the respective countries a better place for people to live.people are just running away from their country because of poor policing.
Using unnecessary force,can never be justified.The rule of law should be adhered to.There are times when,force is justified,but when policemen slaughter innocent Citizens,and people promote that course of action,serious repercussions do arise.Too many persons have been killed,by using unnecessary force.
Jagdeo’s ‘crass and outdated’ statements condoning the use of ‘brute force’ shows how out of touch with reality he really is. While the rest of the caribbean has moved into the 21st century, Guyana continues to exist in the 19th century. The deplorable conditions under which the GPF is forced to live and conduct its business is shameful at best and I am surprised that he had the guts to host this conference in Georgetown and even have them visit the Brickdam Police Station. Instead of calling for ‘lifelong entitlements’ when he leaves office in 2010, he should be insisting that those funds be better spent upgrading the Police facilities. But then again, as self-serving as he is, this should come as no surprise to any guyanese citizen. Shame .. shame .. shame !!
i second you motion, shame shame on jag.